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	<title>Comments on: Highs and Lows 2009</title>
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		<title>By: James Lawless &#8211; View from the Tracks &#187; Blog Archive &#187; More Highs and Lows 2009</title>
		<link>http://www.irishelection.com/2010/01/highs-and-lows-2009/comment-page-1/#comment-123486</link>
		<dc:creator>James Lawless &#8211; View from the Tracks &#187; Blog Archive &#187; More Highs and Lows 2009</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Jan 2010 15:21:48 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: James Lawless</title>
		<link>http://www.irishelection.com/2010/01/highs-and-lows-2009/comment-page-1/#comment-123484</link>
		<dc:creator>James Lawless</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Jan 2010 15:16:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irishelection.com/?p=10519#comment-123484</guid>
		<description>@Mark,

Generally populism implies doing things in a politically expedient manner to court popularity. Of all the adjectives you could use to describe the current government, &#039;popular&#039; is the least likely to appear on the list.

Let&#039;s examine briefly just the three highs I selected in OP.

Budget 2010. Need I say more?

FF Mobilising up North. Arguably this actually distracts from &#039;domestic&#039; (ie 26 county) policy and organisational affairs. The cynics will always talk about the green flag being waved to produce a poll bounce. In reality there is no evidence of this. Any of the excellent &#039;How Ireland Voted&#039; series will confirm there is no discernible polling impact from events north of the border. Depite what many of us may wish for, Clinton&#039;s mantra prevails, &quot;Its the economy, stupid&quot;. Potentially it helps galvanise some of the membership but if so, this is an ancillary benefit.

Yes to Lisbon. Again not exactly a populist cause. Rejected initially by a majority of the electorate it took some convincing to win people round. Again the government did it because it was the right thing to do, but hardly a cheap trick to win votes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Mark,</p>
<p>Generally populism implies doing things in a politically expedient manner to court popularity. Of all the adjectives you could use to describe the current government, &#8216;popular&#8217; is the least likely to appear on the list.</p>
<p>Let&#8217;s examine briefly just the three highs I selected in OP.</p>
<p>Budget 2010. Need I say more?</p>
<p>FF Mobilising up North. Arguably this actually distracts from &#8216;domestic&#8217; (ie 26 county) policy and organisational affairs. The cynics will always talk about the green flag being waved to produce a poll bounce. In reality there is no evidence of this. Any of the excellent &#8216;How Ireland Voted&#8217; series will confirm there is no discernible polling impact from events north of the border. Depite what many of us may wish for, Clinton&#8217;s mantra prevails, &#8220;Its the economy, stupid&#8221;. Potentially it helps galvanise some of the membership but if so, this is an ancillary benefit.</p>
<p>Yes to Lisbon. Again not exactly a populist cause. Rejected initially by a majority of the electorate it took some convincing to win people round. Again the government did it because it was the right thing to do, but hardly a cheap trick to win votes.</p>
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		<title>By: Veronica</title>
		<link>http://www.irishelection.com/2010/01/highs-and-lows-2009/comment-page-1/#comment-123481</link>
		<dc:creator>Veronica</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Jan 2010 10:58:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irishelection.com/?p=10519#comment-123481</guid>
		<description>Mark
(This comment has been awaiting moderation for two days. This is a repost.)

I have to disagree with you on the ideology front – we have ideology coming out of our ears since the foundation of the State; whether it’s the narrow tribal nationalism/republicanism of the two major parties or the tepid socialism/communism of Labour. Not that ideology ever acted as a constraint on adopting populist stances on the immediate issues facing the country when it came to advancing a particular course of action (and smearing their opponents on ideological grounds in the process) in order to gain, or to hold, power. Unfortunately for our main political groupings, the tenets of their respective belief systems crumbled in the late 20th century, begging the question as to what it is they stand for anymore. One could argue that the Greens, whatever one may think of them, are the only party left with a coherent world view underpinning their policy preferences.

The sort of negative politics I’m decrying are, I believe, excusable if still reprehensible, in times of plenty when you have lots of choices. In a crisis, where choices are narrowed, they’re no good at all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mark<br />
(This comment has been awaiting moderation for two days. This is a repost.)</p>
<p>I have to disagree with you on the ideology front – we have ideology coming out of our ears since the foundation of the State; whether it’s the narrow tribal nationalism/republicanism of the two major parties or the tepid socialism/communism of Labour. Not that ideology ever acted as a constraint on adopting populist stances on the immediate issues facing the country when it came to advancing a particular course of action (and smearing their opponents on ideological grounds in the process) in order to gain, or to hold, power. Unfortunately for our main political groupings, the tenets of their respective belief systems crumbled in the late 20th century, begging the question as to what it is they stand for anymore. One could argue that the Greens, whatever one may think of them, are the only party left with a coherent world view underpinning their policy preferences.</p>
<p>The sort of negative politics I’m decrying are, I believe, excusable if still reprehensible, in times of plenty when you have lots of choices. In a crisis, where choices are narrowed, they’re no good at all.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://www.irishelection.com/2010/01/highs-and-lows-2009/comment-page-1/#comment-123466</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Jan 2010 02:21:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irishelection.com/?p=10519#comment-123466</guid>
		<description>Veronica, 

That&#039;s essentially an endorsment of FF campaign tactics then, is it not? FF are the least idealogically driven party in, well, western Europe, they harness public emotion, are pretty overt populist and often contradictory when looked at over a sustained period. So how does one counter that in order to implement preferred policy?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Veronica, </p>
<p>That&#8217;s essentially an endorsment of FF campaign tactics then, is it not? FF are the least idealogically driven party in, well, western Europe, they harness public emotion, are pretty overt populist and often contradictory when looked at over a sustained period. So how does one counter that in order to implement preferred policy?</p>
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		<title>By: Veronica</title>
		<link>http://www.irishelection.com/2010/01/highs-and-lows-2009/comment-page-1/#comment-123459</link>
		<dc:creator>Veronica</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 Jan 2010 09:18:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irishelection.com/?p=10519#comment-123459</guid>
		<description>James,

I spoke in jest! You made the point that negative politics appear to be wroking out for some politicians as reflected in poll ratings; I think that a poll boom solely based on harnessing public anger must turn into a bust at some stage, because it offers people nothing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>James,</p>
<p>I spoke in jest! You made the point that negative politics appear to be wroking out for some politicians as reflected in poll ratings; I think that a poll boom solely based on harnessing public anger must turn into a bust at some stage, because it offers people nothing.</p>
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		<title>By: James Lawless</title>
		<link>http://www.irishelection.com/2010/01/highs-and-lows-2009/comment-page-1/#comment-123455</link>
		<dc:creator>James Lawless</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Jan 2010 17:54:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irishelection.com/?p=10519#comment-123455</guid>
		<description>@Veronica I&#039;m not sure who you are referring to in terms of &quot;which of us is right&quot; as we seem to be saying the same thing? For my own part, I had a very detailed local manifesto, unfortunately I got few enough chances to discuss it during campaign. I was also disappointed at the level of policy scrutiny. As mentioned, national issues clouded local ones despite it being a local office under renewal. We had then head of the INTO screaming about 5th June being &quot;judgment day&quot; for the government when in fact it was purely about who was best placed to provide local representation over the next five years in each area. But the die is cast and c&#039;est la vie.

@Tribeca In terms of Northern mobilisation it has already started and is far beyond the consultative stage. Party fora (a form of organisational structure) have been formally established and launched in three of the six counties, with local officer boards elected and in place. We have a body of registered members right across the six counties, including one sitting MLA. As stated in the original piece, I would hope the push continues into the assembly elections of 2011 which could see us field candidates. I used the &quot;idly by&quot; phrase deliberately, being well aware of its historical connotations, as I personally feel we should have done this long ago. But still better late than never.

In terms of hostility to the party it is difficult to tell. Up until June I was on the doorsteps most nights so pretty direct finger on the pulse. Apart from a bit for Lisbon (when was very well received actually) haven&#039;t been interfacing at that level since. I do think in the wider media though, the mood has shifted from anger to acceptance and a grim realisation that the government has to do what it has to do.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Veronica I&#8217;m not sure who you are referring to in terms of &#8220;which of us is right&#8221; as we seem to be saying the same thing? For my own part, I had a very detailed local manifesto, unfortunately I got few enough chances to discuss it during campaign. I was also disappointed at the level of policy scrutiny. As mentioned, national issues clouded local ones despite it being a local office under renewal. We had then head of the INTO screaming about 5th June being &#8220;judgment day&#8221; for the government when in fact it was purely about who was best placed to provide local representation over the next five years in each area. But the die is cast and c&#8217;est la vie.</p>
<p>@Tribeca In terms of Northern mobilisation it has already started and is far beyond the consultative stage. Party fora (a form of organisational structure) have been formally established and launched in three of the six counties, with local officer boards elected and in place. We have a body of registered members right across the six counties, including one sitting MLA. As stated in the original piece, I would hope the push continues into the assembly elections of 2011 which could see us field candidates. I used the &#8220;idly by&#8221; phrase deliberately, being well aware of its historical connotations, as I personally feel we should have done this long ago. But still better late than never.</p>
<p>In terms of hostility to the party it is difficult to tell. Up until June I was on the doorsteps most nights so pretty direct finger on the pulse. Apart from a bit for Lisbon (when was very well received actually) haven&#8217;t been interfacing at that level since. I do think in the wider media though, the mood has shifted from anger to acceptance and a grim realisation that the government has to do what it has to do.</p>
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		<title>By: Veronica</title>
		<link>http://www.irishelection.com/2010/01/highs-and-lows-2009/comment-page-1/#comment-123452</link>
		<dc:creator>Veronica</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Jan 2010 13:17:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irishelection.com/?p=10519#comment-123452</guid>
		<description>James,

All politicians engage in populism; it goes with the territory. They would never get elected to anything otherwise. 

But populism needs to be tempered with realism in the form of credible policy options. One of our difficulties is that the feasability of the policies offered by our main political parties is not generally subjected to much rigorous analysis, except in the white heat of an election competition, when there is so much on the table and so many attempts being made to appeal to the interests of disparate groups in society that no objective analysis is possible.  And of course, once they get into government, they may find that some of the most cherished of their policy objectives won&#039;t work, and have to be thrown overboard, or that others are fundamentally destructive. FF, FG, Labour and even the Greens, have all shared that experience at different times.

I also think - admittedly probably a minority view among the broader community of posters on political web sites - that populist negativity as a political tactic is ultimately self-defeating. It may appeal to something visceral in the human psyche, and it may bring short term gains for its chief protagonists provided they can keep stirring the pot of public outrage to boiling point, but its futility becomes increasingly exposed over time. 

Conspiracy theries and personalised attacks become self-reinforcing and finally begin to turn people off, especially if there&#039;s nothing else on offer whose viability is demonstrated. I think that is particularly true in times of crisis. So, I&#039;ll be watching the next set of opinion polls with interest to see which of us is right!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>James,</p>
<p>All politicians engage in populism; it goes with the territory. They would never get elected to anything otherwise. </p>
<p>But populism needs to be tempered with realism in the form of credible policy options. One of our difficulties is that the feasability of the policies offered by our main political parties is not generally subjected to much rigorous analysis, except in the white heat of an election competition, when there is so much on the table and so many attempts being made to appeal to the interests of disparate groups in society that no objective analysis is possible.  And of course, once they get into government, they may find that some of the most cherished of their policy objectives won&#8217;t work, and have to be thrown overboard, or that others are fundamentally destructive. FF, FG, Labour and even the Greens, have all shared that experience at different times.</p>
<p>I also think &#8211; admittedly probably a minority view among the broader community of posters on political web sites &#8211; that populist negativity as a political tactic is ultimately self-defeating. It may appeal to something visceral in the human psyche, and it may bring short term gains for its chief protagonists provided they can keep stirring the pot of public outrage to boiling point, but its futility becomes increasingly exposed over time. </p>
<p>Conspiracy theries and personalised attacks become self-reinforcing and finally begin to turn people off, especially if there&#8217;s nothing else on offer whose viability is demonstrated. I think that is particularly true in times of crisis. So, I&#8217;ll be watching the next set of opinion polls with interest to see which of us is right!</p>
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		<title>By: Tribeca</title>
		<link>http://www.irishelection.com/2010/01/highs-and-lows-2009/comment-page-1/#comment-123451</link>
		<dc:creator>Tribeca</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Jan 2010 12:08:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irishelection.com/?p=10519#comment-123451</guid>
		<description>Seconddly, your point that:

Looking at the wider political situation, one of the difficulties for the Fianna Fáil party is that so few of the ‘next generation’ young bloods were elected in this election, as where survivors did emerge it was generally the old dog for the long road, based usually on decades of graft and local relationship building. Full credit to them, but the imbalance will make it harder for the party to renew or regenerate internally, or to introduce any new blood/ideas, which ironically is what the electorate kept saying on the doors was what was most needed.

Take a bow Mr. Aherne I believe. This represents a significant problem for the party especially as the 2004 locals when FF lost 80 seats, followed by 2009 with another 84.

Add in whats going to surely be a fairly fractious General election for the party with candidates working to maximise their own votes and well its going to be a very battered, tired FF machine in a few years.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Seconddly, your point that:</p>
<p>Looking at the wider political situation, one of the difficulties for the Fianna Fáil party is that so few of the ‘next generation’ young bloods were elected in this election, as where survivors did emerge it was generally the old dog for the long road, based usually on decades of graft and local relationship building. Full credit to them, but the imbalance will make it harder for the party to renew or regenerate internally, or to introduce any new blood/ideas, which ironically is what the electorate kept saying on the doors was what was most needed.</p>
<p>Take a bow Mr. Aherne I believe. This represents a significant problem for the party especially as the 2004 locals when FF lost 80 seats, followed by 2009 with another 84.</p>
<p>Add in whats going to surely be a fairly fractious General election for the party with candidates working to maximise their own votes and well its going to be a very battered, tired FF machine in a few years.</p>
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		<title>By: Tribeca</title>
		<link>http://www.irishelection.com/2010/01/highs-and-lows-2009/comment-page-1/#comment-123450</link>
		<dc:creator>Tribeca</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Jan 2010 12:01:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irishelection.com/?p=10519#comment-123450</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;Not standing idly by&lt;/i&gt;

Where did I see that phrase before? So when is the &quot;republican&quot; party going to organise in the 6 counties and stop standing idly by? Or can that only be answered by a consultative body now formulating a report etc etc. 

Maybe &quot;Not standing idly by&quot; is a poor phrase to use.

As a practising FFer have you noticed either an abatement or a contiuatin of the hostility to that party in public etc etc. 

Finally, good long post thanks for putting it up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Not standing idly by</i></p>
<p>Where did I see that phrase before? So when is the &#8220;republican&#8221; party going to organise in the 6 counties and stop standing idly by? Or can that only be answered by a consultative body now formulating a report etc etc. </p>
<p>Maybe &#8220;Not standing idly by&#8221; is a poor phrase to use.</p>
<p>As a practising FFer have you noticed either an abatement or a contiuatin of the hostility to that party in public etc etc. </p>
<p>Finally, good long post thanks for putting it up.</p>
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		<title>By: James Lawless</title>
		<link>http://www.irishelection.com/2010/01/highs-and-lows-2009/comment-page-1/#comment-123449</link>
		<dc:creator>James Lawless</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Jan 2010 11:11:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.irishelection.com/?p=10519#comment-123449</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the feedback.

@Mark,

Yes that was certainly a low, and a particularly infuriating one, I probably missed a few other highs and lows over the year also but it is a quick review of the main points as I recalled them. Arguably this comes in under banking crisis but it was certainly an awful way to end the year.

@Veronica,

Agree the &#039;Politics of Populism&#039; were also a low, as bested by our mutual friend Mr. Gilmore and his comrades. Not constructive but apparently effective, in poll rating terms anyhow.

@All - there isn&#039;t a lot of FF introspection out there on the web (or anywhere outside closed doors normally), and the predominant theme tends to be an opposition (or an ABFF) one.. my reflections are as candid and as objective as I can be, given my openly party political standpoint. If my views were otherwise I wouldn&#039;t be in the party. But I only expect these views to be shared by between 17-23% of the population at present!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the feedback.</p>
<p>@Mark,</p>
<p>Yes that was certainly a low, and a particularly infuriating one, I probably missed a few other highs and lows over the year also but it is a quick review of the main points as I recalled them. Arguably this comes in under banking crisis but it was certainly an awful way to end the year.</p>
<p>@Veronica,</p>
<p>Agree the &#8216;Politics of Populism&#8217; were also a low, as bested by our mutual friend Mr. Gilmore and his comrades. Not constructive but apparently effective, in poll rating terms anyhow.</p>
<p>@All &#8211; there isn&#8217;t a lot of FF introspection out there on the web (or anywhere outside closed doors normally), and the predominant theme tends to be an opposition (or an ABFF) one.. my reflections are as candid and as objective as I can be, given my openly party political standpoint. If my views were otherwise I wouldn&#8217;t be in the party. But I only expect these views to be shared by between 17-23% of the population at present!</p>
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