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Green chance to shine?
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The Greens looking for the a renegotiating of the programme for government is their biggest chance ever to get their policy ideas implemented. They hold now the strongest card they will ever have over Fianna Fail and that is if they withdraw from power then FF face an election from which they may never recover. Fianna Fail know this and will role over on what ever the Greens will want.
The Greens to are facing an election melt down but they have a better chance of surviving an election meltdown then Fianna Fail safe in the knowledge that they could spin the collapse of the government as them doing it for the people. The greens will never have this much power again. They can push policies that none of the big parties would touch in normal times. They can use this to shore up their base and stave off an attack and leeching of votes to the Labour Party.
First off they need a policy that can show that they are influencing the government agenda to a greater extent then they were. First off they should push for the legislation of Gay civil partnership to be implemented. I am sure that this is written and sitting in a desk drawer somewhere. This might pacify some of the attacks from the liberal left.
Another thing they need to address is University Fees. They should stop these being brought back in. This again would signal a reverse in a controversial policy stance that has hurt them among their supporters.
There is probably alot more policy areas that they could seek a government u-turn on. They could put more of their stamp on the rest of government policy. Dig back into their manifesto and pull out the nuggets that can be implemented to shore up their base. They have chance here to grow. The question is will the economy improve because that is the making or breaking of any party in government. They could implement more left wing policies and steel some of Labours thunder. There is no guarantee it will work. But that is the price of government.
Agree totally, but legalising same sex marriage is hardly the first priority. Economic development, planning and climate change come top of the list. Gay marriage would be nice to have but hardly worth walking out of government over.
As a green. Same sex marriage is a priority. But just like the civil union bill. If we rush into it. It will just be overturned by the next gov. Fg and labour included. The fundamentals of transport policy would be something, more of a non car focus. The money isn’t there to do most things. What can be achieved it first off political reform in terms of pay. I’m update with what’s realistic in a while.
Economics does limit alot of what can be done. But headway can be made in non-monetary things. Such as legislation. Bring in civil partnership is more or less economical free. But politically it could pay off for the greens. They would need to focus on the less expensive policies. Another policy that would pay off would be political donations.
There will be no major policy changes in any area before the local elections, and Boyle, Gormley and co. know it. Even if there was, the electorate would see it for what is was, a cheap election stunt.
The Greens have 2 choices: they stay and take their chances with an electorate who now (rightly) hold them partly responsible, or they jump ship now, start swimming rapidly and hope there is a desert island somewhere nearby.
The situation is entirely of their own making: they chose to go into Government, chose to facilitate the Fianna Fáil Golden Circle agenda, chose to do nothing while the economy imploded (even though Gormley now says he saw it coming), chose to stay when there was every reason to walk.
A key indicator of the abject failure of the Greens in Government is the fact that Ireland, alone of all the EU countries, has yet to implement the 1998 Aarhus Convention on Access to Information, Public Participation in Decision Making, and Access to Justice in Environmental Matters, in spite of all the promises, both before and after the 2007 elections.
The Green party are moral cowards, who talk the talk but cannot walk the walk.
On the economy, the Greens don’t have economic policies, they just borrow the script from Fianna Fáil, low corporation tax included.
Stephen, “Same sex marriage is a priority. But just like the civil union bill….It will just be overturned by the next gov. Fg and labour included.”
Why would FG and Labour overturn it? Are you perspnally just into making stuff up, or is this more generally just part of the Cork condition?
“There will be no major policy changes in any area before the local elections, and Boyle, Gormley and co. know it.”
the greens have been in government less than 2 years. to be honest it took them about 6 months to get sorted in all their new roles. understanding that the political system of a cabinet in Ireland only allows for changes in your department only. the rest can be attempted through negotiation with other cabinet members but the final say comes down to the minister in question.
Must I reiterate that the Greens initially rejected the idea of going into government with FF as the initial programme for government gave us nothing.
we then agreed on this program for government. http://www.greenparty.ie/en/government/agreed_programme_for_government
that was only 2 years ago we have achieved a lot of what we set out to do. 86% of our membership agreed that this was worthwhile to go into government with. and we are achieving with all conditions taken into account.
things changed. the economy deteriorated. and rather than a green agenda we have been trying to help the country, not FF, out of this mess that they and the PDs created. although in the 2008 budget we received a boost in capital investment to education. the 2009 mini budgets were not about that
If we could have walked out of government into a FG/Lab government we would have. but the numbers were not there. FG would not talk to SF to create a coalition. and now FG announced lately that if they were to create an alternative Gov after a general election that there would be no GP in cabinet.
walking out was never an option which would have yielded a benefit to green voters. I would have considered them quitters to be honest. and probably left the party. I would also find it very hard to vote for someone that once they received an opportunity to make a change no matter how small turned down that opportunity.
Good call on the political donations though. it could come into effect for the next general election. at least then people would have to declare their donations before the election.
“Stephen, “Same sex marriage is a priority. But just like the civil union bill….It will just be overturned by the next gov. Fg and labour included.”
Why would FG and Labour overturn it? Are you perspnally just into making stuff up, or is this more generally just part of the Cork condition?”
that was misread… i hope.
Civil Union bill is in the process and is being firmly pinned down making sure that nothing is left out and equal rights are recognised. so that it is marriage in all but name. that is why it is taking so long.
When i mentioned the idea of same sex marriage in the new agreed programme for government, which will have to be renegotiated as the old one has now become outdated in light of economic circumstances. same sex marriage would be an unsustainable policy stance.
Civil partnership is accepted by both FF and FG which is and will be for the next 10 years at least 60% of the elected TDs. if we were to renegotiate with the idea of getting same sex marriage. and this were implemented. as soon as we are out of government which is very probable and likely come the next election. the incoming government would just overturn it as both FF and FG are opposed to same sex marriage. yet support civil union/partnership. it would be a waste of our efforts. it happened in California and Irish People in general are deeply conservative.
Political donations is achievable and will increase trust ,marginally, in future election campaigns. anyone have any other ideas?
As for the Aarhus convention. I heard John Gormley mention it at a Environmental Law conference in UCC. He’ll be down in late may and I’ll update ye here. Once I know the exact progress. at the moment I don’t have a clue about its progress tbh.
John Gormley and Eamon Ryan are total shams and are not in any way interested in environmental protection. I make this statement on the basis of established referenced scientific fact, EPA publications and correspondence with DG environment in the European Commision. I used to think Green stood for environmental concern but now in the context of the Green Party I believe it stands for stupid and innocent.
@Tynagh Resident
It would strengthen your hand if you provided examples to justify your rather childish claims that the green party is uninterested in environmental protection.
Unsubstantiated generalities referencing “established referenced scientific fact” are not terribly credible.
Damian, I had not included the references as I have not publicized this matter to any great extent. The pollution in question relates to List i and List ii substances defined in EU directives 80/68 and 20/80. The publications shortlist would be an EPA report from 1996, 2003 and also 2005. EPA correspondence to local authority in 2007, HRB report 2002, EPA IPPC submissions and inspectors reports, license and planning permissions grants, EOS 2008, GSI studies, EU Court 2005 C-282/02 and 2007 C – 248/05 . Correspondence relates to EU Commissioners Dimas and Wallstrom as well as EU DG environment to Irish State bodies.
I state that both ministers are uninterested in environmental protection as I have correspondence from both and in each case they actively state that this sort of environmental problem is nothing to do with them personally and in fact it is the other ministers responsibility. I am being short on fact in a public forum as this issue has been deliberately kept out of the media until now. I don’t however consider myself childish. In time I will publish the conflicting letters from these 2 idiot Ministers and I would bet money that having read them you will be appalled with their ignorance and dishonesty.
Finally if I could leave you with some definitions of the word “Green” from http://www.dictionary.com
immature in age or judgment; untrained; inexperienced:
simple; unsophisticated; gullible; easily fooled.
Damian, I did not state that the Green party were uninterested in Environmental Protection. I stated that Ministers Gormley and Ryan were. I did vote green in the last election, but I don’t think I will again until these 2 are sidelined. (Next election according to recent opinion polls).
Green-FF Desperate Untruths on Incinerator?
There are Local and European elections coming up in June 2009. Did the Green Party publish a truth behind a lie behind the untruth behind a mistake behind the spin?
On Sunday, May 17, 2009, the Green-FF’s leafleted houses with the spin that the Poolbeg incinerator would “collapse” because Covanta could not get finance.
However on Monday, MAY 18, 2009, the Wall Street Journal (WSJ) reported Covanta was selling at least $300 million in 5-year cash-convertible notes to private entities for incinerator construction in Dublin.
The WSJ states:
“Covanta said proceeds from the offering, which will be private, could be used for items including plant construction in Dublin along with potential investments or acquisitions.”
Green-FF omitted this Covanta statement from The Sunday Tribune of May 17, 2009:
A statement issued to The Sunday Business Post on behalf of Covanta Europe president Scott Whitney said the company was
‘‘in the final stages of pre-construction activity, the financing to construct the facility is available and we expect to commence construction when the remaining statutory approvals have been received’’.
And Green-FF also omitted this Dublin City Council statement from The Sunday Tribune:
Seamus Lyons, Dublin Assistant City Manager, who heads the council’s environmental and engineering department, said that Dublin City Council was ‘‘satisfied that Covanta has finance in place’’.