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Deputy Lord Mayor of Dublin, Labour’s Cllr. Aodhán Ó Ríordáin interview
Read more about: Dublin Central, Education, Foreign Affairs, Labour Party 
Deputy Lord Mayor of Dublin, Labour’s Cllr. Aodhán Ó Ríordáin and vocal Anti-War campaigner. Who blogs here answers some questions for Irish Election. Just like to thank Aodhán for his replies.
In your speech at the Jeb Bush protest you said that “Dublin is a major international capital and so its civic leaders have a responsibility to make statements on matters of grave injustice no matter where they occur, be they in the Developing World, in Iraq or in Palestine.” Being a civic leader did you speak out when Hezbollah attacked Israel initially?
I accept that Hezbollah made an initial attack on Israel however I feel strongly that the response of the Israeli government is completely disproportionate. What is happening now in the Middle East is comparable to Margaret Thatcher bombing Dublin, Galway and Cork in response to an I.R.A. bomb in Britain in the 1980s. I didn’t make any comment in response to the initial Hezbollah attacks because I wasn’t asked to. I was invited to speak at the Ireland Palestine Solidarity Campaign march in Dublin and that is where I made those remarks. The Hezbollah attacks, like those of the IRA during the troubles, were of course wrong. However the retaliation of the Israelis is savage beyond belief.
You also referred to the “Bush regime” considering that in 2004 Bush won a clear majority of the vote how can you call that a regime?
I used the word ‘regime’ because I believe Bush bought his election in 2000 and was extremely fortunate that the key electoral state of Florida is governed by his brother. Bush’s foreign policy is extremely dangerous, dishonest and his entire neo-conservative outlook is one that I reject. The use of the word ‘regime’ was deliberate to emphasise the danger that he causes the world.
You also said “The Bush’s regime’s actions in Iraq, of which Jeb is a key supporter, have outraged every right-thinking Irish citizen.” Do you have any proof of this or are you presuming that anyone who disagrees with you cannot be right think.?
I know that the vast majority of the Irish people are very much against the war in Iraq and of the U.S. invasion there. I marched with 100,000 other Irish people against the war in February 2003. If the phrase ‘right-thinking’ offends people then I apologise for that but I know that the war is wrong, and that opposition to the war is right.
You talk about Bush acting in the middle east due to the Jewish vote. If he intervenes in Dafur. Will you say that is for the Black vote.?
He won’t intervene in Dafur. He made some pathetic attempts recently to court the black vote at the NAACP conference however the Bush administration understands that large sections of the black community do not vote and the majority of those who do vote Democrat. His brother Jeb in Florida made sure that a lot of them disappeared off the voting register before the 2000 election.
At the protest it was reported that someone referred to Hamas and Hezbollah as “national liberation movements” did you hear that and would you agree?
I didn’t hear those remarks. I would not agree with those sentiments however the Hamas government were democratically elected. The problem is that the Israeli government are blooding a new generation of terrorists with their current bombardments in Palestine and Lebanon.
Do you think Ireland can do anything to stop the Iraq war?
I think we should outline our opposition to the war. I don’t think we should allow U.S. war planes in Shannon. I think the power is in the hands of the Irish people – if the political parties realise that the war in Iraq is a major matter of concern for people then the parties will respond accordingly. The trick is to make the war an election issue. Hopefully continual protests will do that.
Considering how vital US relations and multinationals are to Ireland, should a public representative be as forthright in criticising the Bush administration as yourself?
American multinationals are interested in profits. They are attracted to Ireland because of tax subsidies. The opposition in Ireland to the war does not bother them at all. If we were to quell our opposition to something we feel strongly about because of financial reasons, that would be a very tragic development for us as a people.
China vetoed the UN extending its peace keeping role in Macedonia During the Kosovo conflict. Due to Macedonia’s recognition of Taiwan. Does this make a mockery of our Triple lock system?
I wouldn’t know enough about that situation to make an informed comment.
What do you believe needs to be done to improve education in this country? Would you approve of a school voucher system similar to the successful Swedish model.?
At the moment we have the second lowest per capita spend on education in Europe. We also have the second highest class sizes. My passion of course is for disadvantaged education and there are thousands of things I would change because the system as it stands is failing so many of our young people.
I would change the way young teachers are trained by taking them out of isolated training colleges and place them in a mainstream university setting to give them a more rounded college experience. I would also make a module on educational disadvantage a compulsory elective so that young teachers would have a better understanding of working class culture, tradition and values.
I would triple the funding that each school receives so that disadvantaged schools do not have to depend on private or charitable donations to pay for basic things like psychological assessments and school tours. I would withdraw state funding for private schools to help achieve this end.
I would make every class have a maximum number of 15 pupils and every classroom should have a classroom assistant to assist the teacher.
The school building programme needs to be radically changed, funded and rolled out much more rapidly.
Education is mot a priority in our country. One in three children who lives in a disadvantaged area has basic literacy problems. That is a damning indictment of Irish society.
You were part of Labours new sports policy. Do you think that money could be better spent on education or health then tax-free grants for elite amateur sports people.?
A friend of mine plays for the Irish international women’s team and has scored 48 goals for Ireland in 56 games over the course of her career. She is of course an amateur and indeed she was unemployed until a few years ago and still shares a room with her mother because she can’t get on the property ladder. She is someone who would benefit from the tax-free grants system for amateur sports people. Money spent on sports is money well spent. Sport is healthy and educational – therefore funding is absolutely justified.
One of Fine Gael’s policies is to remove compulsorily Irish would you support it?
I think Irish should be enjoyed, not enforced. A lot of Irish teachers become disillusioned because they are stuck in classrooms with students who have absolutely no interest in learning the language. We should perhaps make the language compulsory until Leaving Cert level. To be honest, if you haven’t grasped basic Irish by the age of 16 with 12 years of learning behind you, you’re not going to learn it.
Is it imperative the Fine Gael and Labour agree on policy issues (like Aer Lingus e.g.) before the next election or is it necessary for forming a government?
If we didn’t disagree on some issues then we wouldn’t be different and separate parties. It is important that we keep our separate identity and promote our causes of social justice and quality of life issues. I suppose we would be appealing to the Social Democratic soul of Fine Gael and I feel that the public would appreciate some basic understanding of where we would stand on issues of major public importance. However I didn’t join the Labour Party to become an apologist for Fine Gael. It’s a marriage of convenience for the benefit of the Irish people.
Many of the recent polls have showed Labour support being stagnant. What do you believe is the cause, what can Labour do about it and is the green party taking some of your base?
The polls may suggest that, however in Dublin we are buoyant. We are the largest party on Dublin City Council and we had a very successful European campaign two years ago as we almost won two seats. In the Taoiseach’s own constituency of Dublin Central in the 2004 Local Elections Labour outpolled Fianna Fail. Our T.D.s are extremely hard working and are closely identified with local and national issues. Unfortunately Fine Gael and Fianna Fail still have a stranglehold over rural Ireland yet our support base is spreading with high hopes for new seats to be won in places like Meath and Tipperary. I don’t think there is any evidence for your suggestion about the Green Party taking some of our base.
Do you think that the Youth of Ireland will ever be interested in Irish politics?
The youth of Ireland are interested in politics. Look at their reaction to the ‘Make Poverty History’ Campaign. Young people are idealistic and politically aware however they are not inspired by party politics, especially with the history of corruption that many political parties have. Our challenge is to make politics relevant and to show how politics can change things for the better.
You have just started blogging. What do you think of it.?
I like the idea. I was introduce to it by a friend and its something that I’m enjoying at the moment. I find the interaction with other people quite challenging and it certainly keeps me on my toes!
Do you plan to run for the Dail at some stage.
No. I think you can achieve more at a local level. I have no interest in being a back bench TD. I also am keenly aware of the sacrifices that Dail deputies make in their personal lives and I’m not prepared to make those sacrifices. Politics is the art of the possible and I want to achieve things – I don’t want to do it 24/7 like many who have successful political careers.
So is Sam going to the Dubs this year ?
I hope so and I’m pretty optimistic. I know Paul Caffrey quite well and I think he’s doing an excellent job. The encouraging thing about the campaign so far is the strength in depth of the squad. With experienced players like Peadar Andrews, Darren Magee, Colin Moran, Paddy Christie and Senan Connell all on the bench we have great cover for all positions except perhaps for midfield which is a bit of a concern. I also feel that the full back line is a little suspect under the high ball but the balance of the team is right and their attitude is excellent. At the beginning of the year I’d have been happy with a Leinster title and a semi-final appearance. Now I think we can go all the way.
I should state from the outset that I’m not Cllr. Aodhán Ó Ríordáin as he has had a soft touch from the local media with an angle of “I’m an teacher, isn’t it all terrible, won’t someone think of the children and the people who are scared of the GAA”
There are any number of glaringly inconsistent answers in this interview.
A O’R”I accept that Hezbollah made an initial attack on Israel however I feel strongly that the response of the Israeli government is completely disproportionate. What is happening now in the Middle East is comparable to Margaret Thatcher bombing Dublin, Galway and Cork in response to an I.R.A. bomb in Britain in the 1980s.”
but surely a major difference is that Hezbollah are a part of the national government of Lebannon, not that this justifies what the Israelis are doing (I personally think the Isrealis are nuts to be doing what they are currently doing), but if SF were membvers of an Irish government in the 80s then this analogy would have made sense otherwise it is pure farce.
Q – You also said “The Bush’s regime’s actions in Iraq, of which Jeb is a key supporter, have outraged every right-thinking Irish citizen.” Do you have any proof of this or are you presuming that anyone who disagrees with you cannot be right think.?
A- I know that the vast majority of the Irish people are very much against the war in Iraq and of the U.S. invasion there. I marched with 100,000 other Irish people against the war in February 2003. If the phrase ‘right-thinking’ offends people then I apologise for that but I know that the war is wrong, and that opposition to the war is right.
DKS – I was on that march too and I can tell you that you don’t speak for me or a hell of a lot of others. The fact is that as a teacher he should know that correct expression is “I know that the war was wrong, and that opposition to the war was right.” The war in Iraq is over, and good or bad we have to deal with the aftermath instead of whining into our expressos that we were right and Bush was wrong. He was wrong but that won’t make the current situation in Iraq any better.
As for Q- Do you think Ireland can do anything to stop the Iraq war?
A- I think we should outline our opposition to the war. I don’t think we should allow U.S. war planes in Shannon. I think the power is in the hands of the Irish people – if the political parties realise that the war in Iraq is a major matter of concern for people then the parties will respond accordingly. The trick is to make the war an election issue. Hopefully continual protests will do that.
DKS – so our deputy Mayor believes that Irish political parties shouldn’t outline what their position is and through an honest contest of ideas convince the electorate of the rightness of their cause and garner votes that way but that the parties should run about after the views of the people and tell them whatever will get votes.
As for Q – China vetoed the UN extending its peace keeping role in Macedonia During the Kosovo conflict. Due to Macedonia’s recognition of Taiwan. Does this make a mockery of our Triple lock system?
A- I wouldn’t know enough about that situation to make an informed comment.”
Even Mary Lou comes up with a better answer on this issue. Frankly, it is a touch bizarre that someone who likes to talk the talk about what Ireland should do on international issues isn’t even aware of the problems the triple lock has caused.
You know I used to think that someone else was the most lightweight councillor on the city council, now we have a new contender.
I think you’re being a bit harsh there.
Going in reverse order, re China/Macedonia, at least he’s being honest enough to say he doesn’t know enough to answer the question rather than blathering on about any words in the preceding sentence he recognised until the interviewer has lost the will to live.
Re what Irish Governments could do for Iraq, he’s stated what his position and that of the Labour Party is, he then gives some advice to the people campaigning on the issue – make it a voting issue and the other parties will follow (especially true for FF).
Re the War in Iraq/his statement at the rally (“right thinking citizen”), you’re being ridiculously pedantic here. And if you think the war in Iraq is over, I suggest you start reading the newspapers again.
And to your first point (Hizb’allah being part of the Lebanese Gov’t), that would make it okay for the British Government to kneecap David Trimble in retaliation for punishment beatings in the North during the last Stormont Government. The Lebanese system of Government is an all-party power-sharing one, not unlike Northern Ireland’s. It’s actually more complex, because the positions of President, Prime Minister, etc, are all allocated in advance among religious groups (political parties technically, but as in NI, there’s an overlap). As in Northern Ireland’s devolved Government, there’s no collective responsibility (the system we have whereby the Cabinet as a whole is responsible for the actions of each Minister as well as the Minister himself). What’s happening now *is* similar to the RAF bombing Dublin during the IRA bombings of England – they’d target areas they consider to be IRA “hideouts” and claim they weren’t attacking the Irish Government, just the IRA.
“What’s happening now *is* similar to the RAF bombing Dublin during the IRA bombings of England – they’d target areas they consider to be IRA “hideouts” and claim they weren’t attacking the Irish Government, just the IRA”
For that to be comparable, the IRA would have to be in government in Ireland and for the Irish government to have done nothing to stop their actions. And at the same time that the the Irish government had withdrawn the Gardaí and Army from particular areas and allowed the IRA to operate unhinderedin those places enabling them to launch attacks on the British. And also, allowing the IRA to have a substanial presence in Dublin, to broadcast what they want, fundraise how they want and effectively run a state within a state, all with no Irish government response.
All of this, after the British had withdrawn from Northern Ireland. If that were so, then that would be a vaguely valid point.
The Irish Government was using State funds to provide arms to the IRA, in case you didn’t remember.
“The Irish Government was using State funds to provide arms to the IRA, in case you didn’t remember.”
I don’t see the relevance of that contention to your point. If the Irish government gave that policy full public approval, and continued it throught the IRA campaign, then your point would have validity. However, whatever support was given, was when the IRA’s activities were nearly exclusively defensive, was short lived, and was publicly disowned.
This comparision is simply not valid.
but the point for the councillor is that the point was eyecatching and superficially valid. Valid enough for him to try and get votes and transfers from SF in Dublin Central.
As for the harshness, I admit I’m not a fan of the councillor. He has far too many media postings about GAA folk weeing in the door ways of the fair folk around Croker for my liking.
I could have gone with the rest of his interview but I feared losing the will to live if I had to read over the piece again and again.
For example
Q- You were part of Labours new sports policy. Do you think that money could be better spent on education or health then tax-free grants for elite amateur sports people.?
A- A friend of mine plays for the Irish international women’s team and has scored 48 goals for Ireland in 56 games over the course of her career. She is of course an amateur and indeed she was unemployed until a few years ago and still shares a room with her mother because she can’t get on the property ladder. She is someone who would benefit from the tax-free grants system for amateur sports people. Money spent on sports is money well spent. Sport is healthy and educational – therefore funding is absolutely justified.
Surely if you can’t move out of a room with your mother, getting on the property ladder is a least two or three steps away from you. First, you’d find a room of your own, and then start to pay rent. Perhaps even both at once, and then you have to save for a deposit. And doesn’t this sound like he prefers money to be spent on elite amateur athletes in pursuits the general public pay no attention to instead of more generally in sport related health and education efforts? Or am I reading this wrong?
Fact is you should play a sport because you enjoy it and you get a benefit in terms of health from it, and not because you represent Ireland you should be paid. He doesn’t mention which international women’s team either. International soccer I presume. If the public aren’t interested in it, then you should be doing it for yourself.