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Turban lance in the Gardai
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I am in Paris at the moment and thus a bit behind the news cycle here, so I am not sure if anyone has made this point yet, but anyway. I always find it interesting the groups that align in these cases. You can get two groups that never unite unite on an issue such as this: the Irish Times letter writers and the Dana voters.
The Dana voters stance on this issue is far easier to understand. They are highly religious and see this as an equal struggle to there’s, i.e., the perceived fight against the forces of secularisation. To them it is turbans one day, then nuns in schools the other day. The fact that the Gardai never allowed religious symbols (probably to not alienate protestants in the early days of the state) doesn’t matter. This issue has been raised and it appeals to them. They are wondering why not Gardai should be allowed to have them or indeed Padre Pio stickers on the squad cars.
For the Irish Times letter writers, it is the fact that multiculturalism is super great. And all aspects of Ireland should be got rid of and most importantly the Catholic Church. To them seeing a turban on a Garda would be a source of pride a symbol of the new vibrant Ireland, while a Garda car with a Padre Pio sticker would be a source of shame of a backward step. They, however, do not make the same connection as the Dana Brigade. To them this is about religions other then Catholism.
What ever happened to the separation of church and state? For many people who argue that the guy should be allowed to wear the turban are the exact same people who would also be howling about separation of church and state when it comes to schooling. Or indeed anything that has to do with the Catholic Church. Why the difference? It is a black hole in their argument from which no sense can come.
If you want a secularist state, with a separation of Church and State, then you have to accept that the separation of Church and State is not confined to one area, that the separation of Church and State has to be absolute and especially with regard to the people who keep the laws of the state, the Gardai. Officials of the State such as the Gardai in this secularist state must to be separate from Church.
If you think the guy should be allowed to wear the turban and also call for the separation of Church and State in other areas then you are hypocrite. You can’t have your cake and eat it. Pick one. Secularism or not.
That, of course, does not tell my views on the subject, but hey, that’s life.
I salute your blogging indefatigability Simon! Oops, don’t seem to have spelt that right!
And I largely share your approach…
Interesting. I’ve got a view on this, but it’s not entirely formed yet. I’ll stick something up on the blog later this evening. For now, I’ll second WorldbyStorm’s salture, and amplify it with a reference to French keyboards. Where in Paris are you staying, out of interest?
…I disagree with this analysis. IrishElection.com posts are formatted such that only the opening paragraph of each article is displayed on the opening page. Before I opened Simon’s piece in its entirity, all I knew about it was that the piece would go on to argue that these two groupings would agree. The opening paragraph, in other words, did not state what position they would agree on. I presumed it would be a refusal to permit the turban on the beat…
I am In Orsay on the outskirts quiet nice. By the way if no one noticed my posts are always badly written I formulate my ideas as I write the process of writting let me form them. Thus why they often change from the first to the last paragraph.
The problem is that the Gardaí have been just as hypocritical as “The Irish Times letter writers” Simon refers to - they outright banned the turban but only began a review into Catholic symbols after coming under pressure from people holding their supposed attempts at secularism up to the light.
What is there for a secular body to review about Catholic symbols that was not required of other religious symbols?
Lads, a turban is not a symbol of religious belief, it’s an integral part of that belief system. It is a fundamental article of religious practise. to compare a turban to a crucifix or a car sticker shows an incredible ignorance of the sikh religion. quite fankly, I’m amazed that nobody else has mentioned this before now.
The question remains conor that it is a religious symbol in a supposedly secular force. This guy was a reservist if a priest became a reservist would you allow him wearing the collar which is pretty intregral to his belief’s or a nuns habbit etc?
Either you have seperation of church and state or not.